By Mark Morton

How did you go about moving Joe over to bass and becoming a 3-piece rather than finding another member and retaining the 4-member unit?

JS: I moved myself over.

PW: He did, actually.

SD: We didn’t want to get anyone else, either.

PW: You go through so much in a band together, that trying to invite someone else into that circle takes a big commitment. Will it sound better? I don’t know, because it takes a special person to connect musically and personally.

SD: We didn’t shoot the idea down. We decided to go into a rehearsal studio for 8 hours and play with just the three of us to see if anything happens. And if it worked and sounded really, really good, great, we’ll record like that. And if it didn’t, we would have had to figure something else out.

PW: Joe is so talented that he could simply pick up the bass and be amazing. And, we’d played together so much that he already had our structures in his head. He did play bass on one of our older songs, "4am", but that was a different situation. Ultimately, it worked right away.

PW: Yeah, I like it a lot. It’s very aggressive and very melodic.

SD: About six months. Last June/July, we were touring Europe with Dan, and we knew that at the end of that run Dan would be leaving. Then for a couple weeks, we worked on some new songs and arrangements. In October, we were out in L.A. trying to get our previous record label situation worked out and impress them. That didn’t happen. We took Christmas off, and then we played a really important gig at The Bull & Gate as a 3-piece, which was wicked.

PW: That was the real turning point, I think.

PW: You’re dead on.

SD: Yeah, it was. There were also a lot of voices in our ears; people telling us how we should play, what kinds of songs we should write, how we should perform. Regardless, I am still really proud of those four songs. It was a very introverted version of Fiction Plane, with heads bowed and everything. We never thought that we really fit in with the whole British indie rock scene, but those songs somewhat lent themselves to that area, so we gave it a shot. We were feeling no love from our label at the time, and we were just emotionally drained. The really great thing that came out of that era was our introduction to producer Paul Corkett. He produced the EP as well as the new record. He is such an easy guy to work with.

PW: Those were all the result of the artistic side of the band. Despite what a record label wants or an executive says, the goal of an artist is to grow and expand. Every time we got together, we would write something. That’s just what we do, we’re musicians, and we want to constantly create. So we recorded in the studio at every chance we got. Sometimes we were really happy with it, and sometimes it was just something ‘in the moment’ that we’d never play again.

SD: "Better Guy" was a really weird one, because we demoed that one for two years and just couldn’t get it right. I think we played it twice live and absolutely hated it. It was flat and bland, and it didn’t have a chorus. We went into the studio just before Christmas and totally reworked the whole song; all the chords, etc. And that ended up going really badly; well, not badly, but random. But the good thing that came out of that experience was the chorus. Once the chorus was developed, we tried to intertwine it with the original version, which had 4 guitar parts, a piano part…we had to make it work with just the three of us.

PW: That was another one where we got into the studio and tried it as a 3-piece, and we were like, "holy shit, this sounds great!" Sometimes that’s what it takes.

SD: "Presuppose" was originally done pretty much as it is now. The one on the ‘net was a stripped down, live acoustic thing. "Drink" was another one we worked on for a long time. We tried it with electric guitars, and it sounded really bland.

PW: That was one that we really paid close attention to in the studio. If we were going to do an acoustic track, then it had to be something really special. We didn’t want to strip down a song and play it acoustically for no reason. It’s gotta have a personal quality, and its gotta draw you in. "Cold Water Symmetry" was originally this thing that Joe and Setes had done as a Pixies type of thing.

PW: Joe?

SD: I’m going to take a guess…

JS: I’m not here!

PW: If Joe were here, what would he say?

SD: The symmetry of looking at water still. A reflection.

PW: To me, it’s the way the world works. If you drop something into water, it splashes and ripples, affecting everything it comes into contact with.

PW: I don’t know, because most water is cold, I guess.

SD: It wouldn’t sound right if it was called Bath Water Symmetry.

PW: Or Luke-Warm Water Symmetry.

SD: Toilet Water Symmetry!

SD: It’s amazing. On the album, it’s basically an organ, Joe’s vocals, and eventually Pete. I think all I really did with it was put these weird little swells in it.

PW: The amazing thing about these tours is that when you play a song a million times, you get a chance to rethink them. The way Seton developed those swells live was simply amazing.

SD: When we got to the studio, "Anyone" was recorded on the first day. When we finished it, we knew that there was only one place it could go on the album. We really wanted to use it as the opener for all our live sets, too. That song was a true collaboration. I started playing a guitar part, Pete came up with a cool groove, and the lyrics came from a song we had written about a year ago called "Somnambulist". Joe wrote "Death Machine" and "Two Sisters" over Christmas. "Left Side of the Brain" took a couple of turns in the studio before it came out. "Fake Light From The Sun" used to have a huge string section in it.

SD: It was always going to be the single. We knew as soon as we recorded it that it was going to be the single. We finished it up and delivered it to the Bieler Bros as is. They didn’t ask any questions; they saw how passionate we were about the song that they accepted it straight away. They tracked it, mastered it and started getting it on the radio. They loved it.

SD: That’s all good! It’s like three women at once. It’s great!

PW: That would be a good idea for the video, having a woman singing it.

SD: Not anymore. But we’re f***ing done with that.

PW: A lot of it was out of our control, but honestly, a lot of it was also within our control, but we didn’t know it at the time. You kinda take what’s given to you. When you have an opportunity to be signed to a major label, it’s usually a good thing. But now we know that being on any label at all relies on the people at the label truly believing in the music.

SD: Yeah, that has happened so many times to so many bands. It happened to us, too.

PW: And sometimes the bands can’t even recover from it. Sometimes a band will record an album, have it in the can when the executive leaves, and it is shelved.

SD: What the new guy doesn’t want is to inherit something from his predecessor.

PW: Well, it could be a classical jazz label, as long as there is someone there who is on the band’s side and is genuinely enthusiastic about the music; those are the people we want to work with.

SD: We had actually sent them demos 2 years ago, when we signed to MCA. We sent them a version of "Cigarette", which was pretty bad, but MCA eventually saw something in us and signed us. Bieler Bros are big believers in touring and working hard.

PW: They are really great guys, down to earth, funny, and they are music lovers. They are not record executives at all.

SD: No, he actually comes straight out with it.

JS: I’d never even heard of the band, and he says, "yes, I was in Saigon Kick", right away, just to get it over with. It’s a small source of comedy with them. What I like about them is that they aren’t of the mindset of trying to sell a million records at the start. They are like, "let’s sell 10 records now…then lets’ sell 10 more..." and move up from there. That just takes all the mystical rocket science out of it.

PW: They have realistic expectations, and they are in it for the long haul. They’re not going to settle until they’ve given it 110% for one or two years, and whatever happens at the end of that, great! If it’s huge, then we’re all happy, because we won.

SD: We’ve wanted to do another full album now for almost three years.

PW: Yeah, those 70-odd demos you heard on the Internet; if we had a label behind us; that would have easily turned into three or four complete records. For us, the press is an ongoing thing.

SD: With regards to Europe, however, there is plenty of time for set-up. But what we really want to do is make records and tour, and Bieler Bros is completely behind that.

PW: This tour is also a really big thing for us, and we wanted an album to coincide with it that represented us here and now. We didn’t want to hand in a disc full of demos that are two or three years old that really have no freshness value to us. We wanted to shed all that, get into the studio and work with Paul. We didn’t second-guess anything, and it worked great. Yeah, the timeline was short, but we cranked it out in about five weeks.

PW: Well, if we can take advantage of playing in front of 15000 people and win 1000 of them over, that’s a lot easier than trying to fill houses on our own.

SD: The point here is to this as a massive advertisement for the band, play for 30-45 minutes, win people over, and hopefully draw those same people back in to our headline shows when we come back around. As well, we’re getting massive amounts of people to hear our music, whether they like it or not. Hopefully they’re enjoying it.

PW: We know that this tour is a special thing and that we are playing to another band’s audience. This is why we’re dropping in headline shows here and there to support and bolster our own audience. You’ll see a lot more of that on the next leg. And actually, when The Police go to South America, we’re going to stay here and do a month-long run throughout the States, headlining.

SD: They always just sort of pop out.

PW: Most of the time, we really welcome it, as it gives us an opportunity to just go for something that could be really cool. Sometimes it falls flat on its face, but sometimes you hear something really special, and then we’d wish we recorded it.

SD: The one that is in "Cross the Line" was originally recorded as a B-side to the single, which no one has heard yet, and it is just a 15-minute jam session. It’s really cool and has some really good parts in it. Somehow, it just popped up when we started playing "Cross the Line" live, which eventually evolved into the new song.

SD: Joe had written a verse, then Pete had done a chorus, and then we got to a studio and did a bit more of it. It got to the point where we felt we just had to finish the song. We started working it into the set around Dallas.

SD: Yeah, it did. We should really resurrect that at some point.

PW: That’s a good one. Definitely, it actually has a similar feel to the way we play now than any of the other older stuff. It’s rawer and a lot looser.

SD: You know, I never thought of putting those two songs together before, but you’re right. They do have a similarity.

SD: [Pointing] It’s all that guy; we have no opinions on lyrics.

SD: I firmly believe in a band having one sole lyricist.

PW: And not the drummer!

SD: It’s very direct and a very big part of the entity. Live, it’s a way of looking into the singers mind and eyes. I can’t imagine Pete or I writing lyrics. I don’t feel that I have to get my personal beliefs expressed vocally; I let the music do that.

PW: I think for Joe, when he sings, he has to believe what he is saying. There are certain melodies and sentiments he comes up with that are amazing.

SD: Yeah, actually, we’re planning on a live EP to release around Christmas. We’re really keen on doing this.

PW: It’s amazing to have a group of people so devoted to a band that isn’t really huge. We’re quite taken back by how international and personable the group is. We take it as a great compliment to have what is, in essence, an unofficial fan club.

SD: Well, The Daunting is something I’ve been working at for quite a few years. It represents a side of me that is somewhat separate from the band. I like a lot of acoustic folk music, and I really wanted to express something with folk. Left Side of the Brain is a rock record, and The Daunting is something completely different. It’s good to have an outlet to show my different sides. I just love to play music. I’m also in another band in London that plays nothing but covers…badly. We get maybe 2 gigs per year. It certainly doesn’t substitute anything I do with Fiction Plane, but it would be cool to have The Daunting signed to a little indie label. It’s just really enjoyable.

PW: I think, as an artist, you need these different outlets of expression. If you have just one, it can get really frustrating, because you can’t say everything you want to say with that one band.

JS: If you do one album a year, that’s only like 10-12 songs. If you’re a songwriter, those few songs aren’t going to sustain you for the whole year. You’re going to be constantly writing, so it’s good to have a place, like MySpace, for all these little things to have lives of their own.

PW: It’s been absolutely amazing. I can’t tell you. I never thought that my two passions (baseball and rock & roll) would ever mix, but it really is a dream come true. Wrigley Field was really the highlight, the most special union of baseball and rock & roll I’ve ever had. I lied down in right field and gazed at the sky, imagining Andre Dawson right there. I definitely reminisced a bit when I was there. The special moment came was when I got to sing "Take Me Out To The Ball Game". I don’t think Seton knew what was going on. He thought I was having a seizure, because I sang it like a drunken Harry Caray.

SD: Yeah, we have. All three of us do it now. Before, it was just Pete and I, but now Joe’s into it too, and we’re now at about the same level of experience. It’s really been great. Joe has a great move called "The Jesus", where he gets up on his board like this [imitates the classic Crucifixion pose] and stand still. Of course, he sinks, but it’s great; a lot of fun. It’s really hard not to sound cheesy, but there really is a spirituality about surfing. There was one night when Pete and I were out there at sunset, and a seal and a dolphin swam by, and it was just us and the whole sea. Just sitting out there on the water seems to make all your problems go away.

PW: That’s a good way to put it, actually. We definitely don’t fall into the cookie cutter, vanilla, American radio mold. I think that if we can do that and do some acoustic songs, great.

SD: I think we’re not really good at being pigeonholed. It might actually really start working to our favor one day. We’ve always found it difficult to be a band that record company people and journalists can say, "oh, they are this kind of band" or "they play that kind of music". They find it difficult right from the start to really stereotype us in anyway.

SD: And that is what I think is most intriguing about a band like us. We don’t actively try to be like any other band. It’s like one of my favorite albums, the first Rage Against The Machine record. That album had such an amazing sound, it was unique, and I don’t think anyone can ever duplicate it again. With us, I don’t think we could really re-record Left Side of the Brain and have it sound the same, because we’re always trying new things.

PW: I think the best way to describe us is a rock band that is genuine to its musicianship and its art. When you come to see us live, you get to see exactly what we are. You see all of the emotions right there on our sleeves. Our influences are pretty diverse, though if Joe says something like…

JS: [A voice from the ether] Smashing Pumpkins is lame!

PW: I love English Beat, but I don’t get the same things out of it as Joe does. And he doesn’t like Rush as much as I do, but we all really appreciate them.

SD: I don’t really know much Rush.

JS: I am the biggest Rush fan, come on!

PW: But we appreciate it all, and we take little tidbits from what we love. We essentially follow each other’s lead. Like if Seton takes us down a Rage Against The Machine-styled path, we’ll go there, because we love it. Or if Joe takes us down a soft, delicate, intimate type of path, we’ll go there, too. It’s a hodgepodge with sincerity.